Five Years from Now

by Ms Rebecca

A lovely woman asked me years ago what I saw myself doing in five years. I took a couple of days to think about it and then wrote a letter to share my thoughts with her. I did a search for it on my computer and found the file! Shock of all shocks, my life today looks nothing like what I see in that file. God has a way of derailing our dreams in an effort to push us toward our purpose. This update is a 20/20 look in hindsight at what the Lord has done from 2015 to 2020…not what I dreamed of in my limited scope, but the much larger picture only seen through His lens.

2015

I am asking God to pull your heart toward this post. It is long and laid bare…a prayer conversation with both God and some special people. For those who do not know, please forgive the lack of telling! Ron and I both lost our primary source of income AND God’s response has been focus on Scholar Ministries. What follows is a current conversation with those I look to for counsel:

If you wouldn’t mind, I have some issues that I would love for you to pray about?

I believe that YHVH has given me some direction in response to my time with some very prayful/prophetic ladies and the well-timed reading of a particular article. Here is the body of the article written on May 5, 2015 by Shawna Gaines:

CO-PASTORING & MARRIAGE: 5 THINGS THAT HELPED US SURVIVE IT ALL

MAY 5, 2015 BY SHAWNA SONGER GAINES

“My pastor friends ask, “How can you work with another co-pastor?”

My married friends ask, “How can [you] work with your spouse?”

To be honest, there was a time when my answer would have been, “I don’t know and I don’t wanna.”

My husband Tim and I have been co-pastoring the church of our dreams for the last three years. But believe it or not, co-pastoring was not in our “life plan”. Early in our relationship we struggled with anxiety about the balance of our individual callings, and how life and ministry would unfold for each of us, together.

In our early days of dating and marriage we had seen very few co-pastor models, and the models we had seen didn’t make us crave the possibility. Some might say that Tim and I are both “strong personalities,” which seems like a nice way of saying that we are annoyingly extroverted and stubborn as all get out. How do two people like us work together?

Ordination
To give a bit of perspective, the worst fight of our wedding planning had nothing to do with colors, flowers, or guest lists. No, we fought over which scripture passages required further exegesis in the ceremony.

We assumed that co-pastoring would be disastrous for our church and for our marriage.

But our days in education and preparation were humbling… deeply humbling. We no longer looked at ministry as a career path to pursue, but as a sacrifice of our lives and our life together. It changed everything.

We never put resumes out for co-pastoring. Shockingly, that’s not a category on monster.com. We never sought the position we hold now. Somehow, when Bakersfield First Church of the Nazarene heard about us, they didn’t ask about “Tim” or “Shawna”, but “Tim and Shawna”. And with some divine intervention we stumbled into a wonderful, “yes.”

On our drive from Chicago to Bakersfield, with our 4 month old son and dog in the back seat, we had endless conversations about how to divide responsibilities and manage tasks as co-pastors. We felt we came to some very wise and reasoned decisions, most of which we threw out the window in the first 6 months of co-pastoring.

But over the last three years I feel like we have learned so much and grown so much. So if you are asking either of the two questions which began this post, here are 5 things that have helped us survive and even thrive as co-pastors and as a couple.

1. Mutual Submission

The most frequent suspicion about co-pastoring is that “someone has to be in charge”. On which desk does the proverbial buck really stop?

Ephesians 5:21 has become an important verse for our ministry. Co-pastoring works because Jesus has charge over our church, life, and marriage. We submit to one another out of our love for Christ.

Many friends have told me, “I could never work with my spouse, it would be terrible for our marriage.” Learning to co-pastor was not without great pain and grueling self-examination. But three years in, I can honestly say that our marriage is so much better than it has ever been!

The false narrative that “someone has to be in charge” has infected far too many Christian marriages… and this narrative is simply not Christian! Christ is the head of a Christian marriage, and Godly men and women happily and joyfully submit to one another in a love shaped on the cross to the glory of God the Father.

2. Advocate for One Another

We were only dating when the idea occurred to us that it might be difficult for both of us to pursue a calling to ministry. Which one would get the job that moved us here or there? Would we take turns pursuing this calling? Would one of us be on the sidelines for a season?

Young and naive, Tim and I vowed that we would always advocate for the other. I would never push forward my desires, ambitions or career. Instead, I would make my primary task to promote and encourage his aspirations and dreams. I would do this with the reassurance that I had an advocate too. Tim would likewise not pursue his own desires or ambitions but be my advocate in ministry and life in every way possible.

Advocating for each other has been harder in some seasons than others. But we’ve learned the harder it is, the more necessary it is. Tim left an ocean view office in San Diego when I asked that we move to Kansas City to attend seminary. I gave up an incredible ministry opportunity back in California to live through the bitter winters of Chicago while he worked on his Ph.D. I’ve shed some tears but I’ve never regretted being his advocate. Not one loss. Not one sacrifice. Not one good-bye. Never.

3. The Eight O’Clock Rule

When our children were both new borns, up at all hours of the night, we made a rule that nothing we said to each other at 2am could be held against us. This tipped us off that timing and talking is important.

When you work together, live together, and raise kids together, that’s an awful lot of together. As much as co-pastoring weaves something beautiful of church, life, and family, we’ve learned that there must be boundaries for each of these things.

One night I came back from a late night hospital visit. It had been emotionally exhausting. I told Tim all about it as I got ready for bed. Relieved to have gotten that experience off my chest, I settled into my pillow and got a great night’s sleep. Tim laid awake for hours bearing the burden I had just unloaded.

We decided that after about eight at night it becomes really unhealthy to talk about anything relating to the church or ministry. It makes it hard for our brains to wind down from the day and can potentially stir up two tired pastors to bicker or stress when we need to be cuddled on the couch in our jammies with a bowl of popcorn. After eight we can talk about the kids, bills, Jimmy Fallon, and how much I hate our cat… but not the church, because we want to love each other and the church for a very long time.

4. One Office, Two Pastors, One Voice

When I say, “one office” I’m not talking about a room with a desk and some cabinets. Tim and I each have separate rooms we call offices and that is very helpful. I am talking about the office of the pastorate, the office responsible to shepherd and guide a congregation in Christlikeness. I do believe that in each congregation there is one office of pastor.

I know I have advocated for mutual submission under the Lordship of Jesus, and these two points need not contradict as the office of pastor is submissive to Christ, and in that, a servant leader. There is one office from which a local congregation receives a vision of Kingdom life embodied in the context of a particular community and people. There is one office that cares for and oversees the preaching and teaching of the Word and administration of the sacraments.

But one office does not have to mean one pastor and one person. We are two pastors who share one office. So the vision we cast, the care we give, and the oversight we administer is done in unison and partnership. We share all responsibilities that pertain to these ends. We divide up the responsibilities that do not.

We don’t always agree on everything and we often make mistakes. I’ll give someone an answer, not knowing that Tim had been asked first and had given a different answer. But we both respect the sharing of one office and in doing so, we are careful to speak with one voice.

We are careful to talk through most important matters before we are ever put on the spot. But there are still times when Tim says something in a board meeting and I disagree or I make an announcement in church that makes him uncomfortable. When these things happen, we do not contradict one another. We speak with one voice. What he says, I say. What I say, he says too. Kinda like good parenting!

Speaking with one voice takes a lot of trust in the Spirit. If we truly believe it is the Spirit speaking in and through us and bringing to light the word of God for the people of God, then why would I contradict my co-pastor whom God has called and filled with the Spirit? Then again, I guess marriage takes a lot of trust in the Spirit too!

5. Irreverently Holy Laughter

As hard as it can be to share the burden of pastoring with your spouse, we also share the great joys and, let’s be honest, the hilarity of church life. I have had run ins with people – made in the image of God, bless their hearts!!! – that requires some side splitting laughter… alone in my prayer closet of course. I can’t share that moment with anyone in the church… except my co-pastor. As great as jammies and popcorn are, nothing relieves the stress of a long day, week, or month in ministry like tears-down-your-contorted-face-I-just-might-pee-my-pants laughter.

Yes, co-pastoring is hard work.

It’s hard to constantly have to submit, advocate, share, and talk through decisions. Then again, I’m not sure what kind of pastor I would be if I didn’t do those things. I’m not sure what kind of wife, mother, or child of God I would be. So I am grateful for this opportunity we stumbled into together. We will keep stumbling forward after the Spirit’s leading.”

I read another article not long before this on the need for women role models as pastors. God has used all of this to weave together the urge to devote my life and accept my calling, not as a pastor’s wife, but as a “co-Pastor” in one “office” with Ron.

Now, Ron went happy wacko on this one! He is so excited that God has revealed MY path and is handing me books and, like a happy puppy running around in circles, is asking when are you going to start, what school, have you looked for an online degree program….that was what last week was like. 🙂

Now for this week and the next issue to talk with God about… I see Ron becoming more and more depressed. The bills are coming in and he doesn’t have a “job”. At least, that is the way he sees it. No income. House payment is late. The two car payments are coming up this next week. Wife has a purpose to pursue. Ron has the work of a pastor/missionary to a hungry church (literally and physically), but no pay.

All we still know on this account is that “We are not supposed to go after a 9-5 pm job, but instead focus on Scholar Ministries.” That’s it…no other word from God yet…

Granted, I have panic attacks if I think too hard about the bills because I can’t see the future either, but Ron is starting to hurt over the lack of income. We both want to honor the only “word” we have been given referring to income, but the pressures of this life and this world and the people around us are beginning to be very intense.

I don’t have the words that I hear missionaries speak about trust and provision. I don’t have anything but stubborn obedience? My head knows the scriptures, but my heart is heavy. The phrase “Do it afraid!” comes to mind only my phrase is “Do it blind!”

Suffice it to say that we need intercession and provision! Only God can bring willing hearts with little time/energy/health, but with a calling to feed a hungry church (physically and mentally), to a conviction that FUNDS and INTERCEEDS for us. I know those precious hearts are out there! I really do! I smile/cry when The Pack Shack, a ‘feeding the hungry’ in a physical way non-profit run by a friend of ours, invites Ron to teach their crew and then loads him up with food for both our home and Scholar Ministries. How incredible is that? I smile/cry when biblestudy groups combine their resources and cover last month’s house payment. I smile/cry when the people around us who understand our walk and its challenges gather together and counsel/intercede for us!

For right now…all I know to do is love on Ron, keep working to see my sons succeed, and keep feeding Scholar Ministries’ hungry children. If random landscape jobs come thru, we do them. If things can be sold, we sell them. If things can be given away, we give them away. And when all else is done, I simply hold on to the prophetic word spoken over me by a precious young man at IHOP-KC: God sees that I give until there is nothing left to give and promises that I will not be forgotten. He sees me and I am right where I am supposed to be.

I know this is a lot to pour out at your feet, but for those who care to read till the end…thank you…(tired sigh). You can share this prayer request with any individual you feel would join in.

2019 Update

I reposted this on FB in 2019 and wrote a little blurb. I’ll share that with you first and then give you the 2020!

“4 years ago! Wow! We are now debt-free, Ron has a full-time job and has turned over the teaching to me for a while so he can rest for a bit (teaching on The Land – Things Every Brainiac Should Know About Israel), heading overseas the 17th of June to Israel for the first time, teaching in Northwest Arkansas most Wednesday/Friday nights and in Berryville once each month, recieving and reselling property to raise funds for the work we do, and I am building a barnhouse in Papa’s old shop.
A lot can change in four years! Don’t give up!
Ms Rebecca”

2020 Update

It’s been five years since the “Shemittah” or shǝvi’it ( שביעית, literally “seventh”). It was the Sabbatical year 2015 and, not just that, but the Sabbath of Sabbatical years! The seventh of the sevens…

Scholar Ministries had been studying the Year of Jubilee and the question was asked

“If we want to celebrate the Year of Jubilee, what would it look like?”

At first, the question was brushed away without serious contemplation so it was asked again.

“If we want to celebrate the Year of Jubilee, what would it look like?”

Again…the question floated away. But then…

The result of this strange and demanding question meant that Ron and I would make the serious attempt to keep the Shemittah. Our regular work had been stopped for us by the painful loss of our jobs which obviously set off a domino affect through our finances, our home, and our ministry. But then…

God brought us through the sabbatical. We sold our home and used the proceeds to buy an RV. All our debt was paid off during the two and a half years we lived in a home that measured 32 ft long by 8 ft wide. We lived and worked in a few of the most beautiful places in Benton County…a campground, a Army Corp of Engineers park near Lost Bridge, and a wonderful pastoral couple’s backyard. AND, of course, my mother-in-law’s barn in Carroll County!

I don’t want to give you the wrong impression because it wasn’t all sunsets and swimming. We walked through a lot of desert in the past five years. There was great sadness as we watched on youngest son go through some terrifying situations and mental illness. There were periods of great anxiety and betrayal. There was worry about finances. There were withdrawals as a worship leader and teacher. There was grief in our ministry as we watched treasured friends walk away. I will tell you straight up that the trauma we have walked through in the past five years far bypassed the trauma of my step-father murdering my mother and then taking his own life as well. That was a horrifying time for me, truly, but the things that have occurred in the past few years brought me to my knees and destroyed my strength.

But then…

God never left me. He never lost me. He never became silent. He counseled me, trained me, walked me and carried me through all of it! I see how He cared for and preserved my sanity. I see how He set me free from debt and lifted the heavy burden that money (or lack thereof) had become. He is STILL bringing me back as a worship leader. I am not yet free in this one area, but He is slowly allowing me to grow back into that dream. He has given me spiritual sons and daughters (I call them quasi-sons and quasi-daughters) to love on and is NOW giving me TWO coming quasi-grandchildren. God has given us the ability to create a home that fits us superbly without a single drop of debt and allowed us to live just across the drive from my beautiful mother-in-law. We are her security staff ;).

My tough loving Father has, yes, stripped me of several dreams in order to give me the true desires of my heart. I am still deeply in love with my first and only love, Ron Smith. I get to travel (we even got to go to Israel!!!), teach, and worship. I live without the huge weight of bill after bill after bill. We now have very few bills and I am LOVING that! I live surrounded by beauty that I created out of the store of all that God has trained into me, the “Barndominium”. Scholar Ministries is stable and produces the most spectacular fruit!

Five years later and we are happy! We are free! We are stable! I wonder, with hope and confidence, what life will be like five years from now???